Black Raven Dragoons

[Grimblast]

I know we've mostly sworn off WOW but this Blizzard forum post highlights something I was seeing back when I played WOW. I white knighted so often to help people like the affected person in the posted/translated thread that it did burn me out after several years and people burned me over that time because only a small amount ever reciprocated help back to other players. Even now while I play Guild Wars 2, I still help the new guys that seem to actually still be filtering in that are willing to accept help. Kudos for the guy on the Korean server for helping somebody that wasn't sure how to play though. That still gives me hope for humanity but I wish WOW didn't go the way it did. The community is partially responsible for me quitting that game in the end. With the whole looking for group and raid tools, the game becomes less social which I hope never happens to Guild Wars 2. All the WOW players migrating to it want the tool I'm sure but that would be a bad idea in my honest opinion. I'd rather keep the Guild Wars 2 community social.

[Zancarius]

I can't believe I read the whole thing, but that certainly makes for a sad story. Elitism is something that seems to have gravely affected WoW. I can't say I'm terribly surprised; many casual players have left for other games that weren't so demanding. Let's face it: 6-8 years of wasting hours and hours and hours on a game wears thin after a while and the WoW community isn't getting any younger. Save for a drastic change in development, I don't imagine this is going to change.

(Ironically, this story illustrates why. When all you have left are elitists, new players don't feel welcome. Since the average age of the WoW player is increasing, you've only got the dedicated few who aren't themselves burdened by RL obligations to the point that they have to quit. That said, MoP was a blatant pandering--pun intended--to the Chinese market probably in effort to stem the hemorrhaging.)

But, I feel like playing Negative Nancy today:

I know one of the things that bit us a few times, you in particular, is something likely tied to cultural differences between the US and SK. On more than one occasion, we've helped new players understand the game better only to have them jump ship for greener pastures because they weren't willing to reciprocate or because they didn't feel they were progressing as fast as they needed to be. In this story, I suspect the "outcast warrior" would have been loyal to the end toward anyone willing to help him. While we were fortunate enough to experience this sort of loyalty from time to time, it seems rarer among the US player base. I may be wrong, but I can't help myself from thinking this is mostly due to cultural differences.

I think, ultimately, that's the sort of thing that burns you after a while. You spend hours working on teaching someone about the game, helping them out, sending them gems/enchants/etc., only to have them bail out and join up with a "proper" raiding guild because they want more. Perhaps they even felt entitled to "more." After all, they spent the time to learn the game; everyone owes them, right?

Fortunately, GW2 isn't as competitive in the sense of requiring players to obsess so intently over gear that it causes a mass consolidation of population toward a handful of guilds, so I can't say I've seen this sort of behavior there. I'm sure it exists, but WoW was a different game entirely. In some regards, people took it way too seriously...

Now, I will say that there are merits to a dungeon finder. In WotLK (since I never did use it under Cata), the Finder was useful for grinding out daily dungeon requirements or whatever, and gathering up gear at a pace the player was comfortable with. I used it to gain experience with healing and to flush out my healing set, and I suspect many others used it for similar purposes. I didn't really see it as something that diluted the "social" aspect of the game (you're still playing with other people), it just streamlined the process of getting something done. I suppose if one were to define social as hanging out around a dungeon entrance and spamming LFG, then perhaps the impact was dramatic. Otherwise, it was simply a means to an end.

That said, I have no idea what the raid finder was like. Given that raids are entirely different beasts and given the caliber of personalities that want to raid, raid, raid, I can only imagine it as an exercise in frustration.

Ironically (for me), GW2's forced social aspect has made the game somewhat less social than WoW. Since there's really never much need to party up with someone to get events and such done, it's almost as if players just join up into a virtual mosh pit of destruction to work together--anonymously--toward a common goal. When the goal is achieved--similarly to the dungeon finder of WotLK days--people part ways without a word. Oftentimes I'll run up and help someone (picking them up or killing something) and neither of us makes so much as a peep. There's almost no need: GW2 is the most social non-social game (or most non-social social game). Consequently, I have exactly two contacts outside of guild: One from doing a jumping puzzle with Trekk and the other from leveling. I've never said a word to either of these people since.

Granted, I stay out of map chat most times, so perhaps that's why, but given the level of conversation that tends to plague the channel, I think it's probably for the better. I don't really want anything encouraging my trolling habits more than necessary.

[Grimblast]

Granted, I stay out of map chat most times, so perhaps that's why, but given the level of conversation that tends to plague the channel, I think it's probably for the better. I don't really want anything encouraging my trolling habits more than necessary.

Or if you're Jargath, just exit all chat channels!

But seriously, I know what you mean. I'm sure they will make such a tool in the future since my one opinion is dwarfed by everyone else. I didn't play the first Guild Wars long enough to see what they did with that game when it came to the dungeon content if it even had any.

[Jargath]

You mean there are chat channels?

[Zancarius]

hahaha

Maybe, but TBH you're not missing much. Except guild chat (map chat? ugh...).